tushanshu_ooc | More Changes! (AC/Endgame)

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More Changes! (AC/Endgame)

(I am so sorry to keep filling up the OOC comm with these posts, we're trying to roll the changes out as they're coming up.)

ONE. Effective immediately, we are removing the double activity requirement for applying for a 4th character and changing it to "having passed the last two consecutive ACs with your full roster". This does not include passes gotten by hiatus or by new character exemption. The strike policy (one per character every six months) has not changed. If this goes well, we may consider expanding to larger rosters in the future.

EDITED TO ADD: If you are on hiatus but have passed the previous two ACs before the hiatus, you can still apply for a 4th character. For example, if you passed January and February's AC normally and were on hiatus for the month of March, you could still apply for a 4th character in April.

TWO. Later in June, the modteam will be reviewing the proposed endgame that was put into effect last year, to see whether it still fits with the plan of the game -- specifically, we will be looking at removing it if that seems feasible. As such, we'd like to invite all our players to express their opinions on that potential change in this post.

Thank you!

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One: stop making it so easy to app a fourth character, gdi.

Two:

a) I think I'm in the majority here when I say a lot of the "slowing down" of the game did begin around the time our original mods announced an endgame. It made sense objectively, especially as a sort of "warning" so far in advance so people could plot accordingly, and wasn't a big surprise to those of us who'd seen Roy and/or Alex talk about the game only being planned X number of years on plurk, etc etc...but there was just something about that sense of "okay you have this much time left and then ALL DONE" that sort of put people off. So I am extremely happy to see that plans to end the PLOT are still being carried out on schedule, but with the intentions of continuing the game afterwards with new shenanigans and adventures. A world like Tu Shanshu has so many possibilities. Personally, I can think of a dozen potential plots off the top of my head.

b) There was also another factor which may have contributed, and I think it was the shift in tone to a more War-like setting. Now, don't get me wrong--I'm hardly complaining in the least. I LOVE it. I think it's exciting and is really driving the game forward even moreso than when I first apped. Things are happening, and even during the downtime, there's that sense of unknown and mystery in the air. Even more so than when the game was first starting. I have two characters who are very much invested in this plot as well, but considering I also play Midii, I can somewhat empathize with those who felt like their character suddenly had much less to do. Not even so much because of a "darker" setting, per say, but simply because a lot of the subsequent plots and happenings were somewhat catered to characters who could fight. Which is to be expected, but I think it also ignored a lot of hidden potential for so much more to be done. Yes, the main purpose of the game is to defeat the big baddy. But in focusing on the offensive, a good portion of the Turtle Life has been lost.

Let me give an example: when the explosion plot hit, most everything was plotting how to help directly with putting out the fires or checking for more explosions or trying to find out clues as to who did it, or how to deal with those who were severely injured or even died. Characters dove straight into burning buildings to drag people out, and a lot of threads were very action-y based. What got lost in all the chaos were the few characters who took on entirely different roles. Midii, for example, was a very passive participant. She was a victim, yes, but once she arrived at one of the Shelters that had been set up, lost and dazed as she was...she accidentally found a purpose: to help look after the youngest of the children. The innocents in all of this. Even something as simple as reading them a story while everything else was going on around them, to take their minds off of the scariness of it all.

I think if some of the happenings of the game were broadened to give characters with those kinds of stories a chance to be told or heard from, it would open up so many more possibilities for muns who might otherwise feel like they've reached a Limit to what they or their character could do. Have missions with a little more variety. Not just sieges and highly advanced technological research, but even the smaller things like doing repairs to the city or trying to maintain the peace among the locals--whom have been repeatedly established as non-fighters. Not to say that some of this isn't already happening, but that I think it should be MORE of a presence. Show MORE of the city that everybody's trying to defend, and more to the War than just the fighting.

I know it was hinted at that something re: the baby Turtles might be happening soon...so that's a good start? Maybe? I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE UP TO SO I CAN'T SAY FOR CERTAIN but you know what I mean.

Okay yeah I'm just gonna spend today riding on other people's more eloquent coat-tails, but this too!

Armin CAN fight, but it's very firmly established in canon that he sucks at it. When I try to shoehorn him into fightan-type situations it just... doesn't feel right or mesh well. He's so thoroughly outclassed by both his surroundings and peers that I have a hard time finding a place for him in the current plot. He usually ends up being pushed to the side. It doesn't help that I'm kinda shy, so when big plot events like the log when the explosions started happening, I... didn't have any threads or tags. I'm still kicking myself for not doing better on that one, but you can see what I mean. That was also like, right when all my CR started to vanish, so I couldn't count on that to help me.

BASICALLY WHAT I'M SAYING IS yeah Hina has the right idea. There are a lot of big, powerhouse type characters on the Turtle, but there are also weaklings like Armin that aren't particularly remarkable, and I'm kinda lost on a way to contribute. I'm trying to fix it, like right now on the CR meme, but if I can be helped somehow I'd also appreciate it.

Hey! Hina got my longer reply and I hate copy/pasting, so you get the short version. c;

Basically I'd love to brainstorm ideas of how we, as mods, can help to encourage players to do their own things and create non-war happenings (in addition to taking this into consideration with the missions). I think our ultimate goal is to give players the tools/platform and encouragement to feel more freedom in developing their own plots, but I know that takes time. Please throw out any ideas you might have, no matter how feasible! Brainstorming is awesome.

I think one problem is a communication of such projects going around? Armin, living in Wood and not knowing how to drive any sort of vehicle, can only travel as fast as he can run, so he's rather limited in places he can go. It's supposed to take a few hours on foot to get to sector to sector, right? So for open logs in other sectors... I usually can't get into those for distance logic reasons. He also barely understands technology, and the communication systems have been unreliable for so long that what he used to lean on to keep track of things is gone. So he just honestly, in an IC sort of way, does not know of things going on.

I think that's a first hurdle that needs to be addressed? Sometimes I'll just, uh-- what's the word-- contrive a reason for him to be somewhere if it's super important, but otherwise, I often have trouble. This could also be a problem for new players that might app a character that can't fast-travel or communicate in a way secondary to the network. They wouldn't have a way in initially.

I understand what you mean, and while I was aware of the time it took to walk I hadn't realized it could be problematic for certain characters to justify themselves in logs that happen on the other side of the turtle. It's a good point and thanks for bringing it up, we'll keep it in mind. Something like Foreigner-endorsed vehicles or some a character creating a pseudotaxi business would be a good idea, haha xD

A silly idea though, this is just me as a player trying to help another one out: there are some characters who have handwaved good relationships with Kedan neighbors, or the drivers of vehicles, to justify them just getting drives to places? Armin has a way to make people just want to pet his head and help out, he could manage that I'm sue.

Lol yes, on those occasions where I just gotta be somewhere I assume that Armin gets a hand somehow. He used to work at a Kirin barn that got burned down, and he does know how to ride a horse very well thank God, so sometimes I just handwave A KIRIN DID IT.

But yeah, I worry for new applicants, especially when we need new blood, they will need something available to them to make it easy for them to communicate right off the bat or else they probably won't stick. If I were to app Armin right now as things are, a lone canon warrior with no powers, I would have no idea what to do to get 'in'.

To be honest, I had forgotten about the hours between Sectors thing. It's something I'll be looking into more as I think it has a definite impact on baseline characters (like all three of mine). Thank you very, very much for bringing it to my attention.

Hopefully Aya's plan with the radios can help with some communication barriers that you were talking about before as well, but I understand it's a larger issue.

Please don't hesitate to continue replying with new thoughts or ideas. Seriously, I can't thank you enough for bringing these up.

Hey, you guys are doing a great job, I'm super impressed with the transparency here. I know it can't be easy to do. I've been worried about some of these things for awhile, but seeing them being addressed makes me feel way better!

First off, thank you so much for taking the time to right this and for offering real criticism. That's what we want!

You make a really excellent point about the war tone being catered to certain characters type and I've heard similar sentiments from other players. We can certainly keep this in mind and make an effort to extend mod missions to include these kinds of things, but I think our ultimate goal is inspiring players and providing them with the platform to write more of their own player missions. Repairing a specific building and uncovering a ruin, for example, could be an awesome player-run mission and something I would love to see - and even to help write! Like I said though, we'll definitely be aware of it and can make an effort to include more in mod missions as well.

Can you think of other ideas, in addition to the missions, where we, as mods, could help support this? Things like the Hydroponic Garden are some of my favorite in character happenings, but they were presented by players. I'd love to brainstorm ways that we could help encourage those kinds of less war-like ideas (beyond the monthly lighthearted events we already have planned)!

You are absolutely welcome! I only save my tealest dears for the games I'm truly invested in, after all. ^_~

I don't have anything concrete at the moment, but there are a few ideas kind of floating around my head right now.

Like you said, there's the possibility of gardens. Or, assuming that Rations are going into affect once more, people who might be able to focus on things like food and supplies deliveries. It's something even a (capable) child would be able to do. Make them feel important enough that they're actually making a difference, since supplies are essential to any war-field. I know one player had recently suggested a postal service (Akito's mun, I think?), so this would be expanding a little further onto an idea that might have a more pressing need than postal.

There could be some Black Market shenanigans going on as well. Either the gangs of Fire getting restless and/or some For The Greater Good things happening, where people start to negociate less than honorable deals for honorable reasons. This could easily stem off some recent player activities in Fire where character such as Asami, Annabeth, and Zatanna had infiltrated their gang bases and taken down those who were raiding supplies from honest stores. The interesting thing about doing a Black Market as well would be to kind of blur the line between Good and Bad, as tends to happen in a War setting,

Soup kitchens are a possibility, if there are locals who were hit so hard by any recent attacks that their homes and resources were destroyed. Or a food bank of some kind. I recall a long time ago, Damian had made an arrangement with Eshai for the children of the Turtle, where those who were young enough would be absolved from Rations restrictions because THINK OF THE CHILDREN etc etc.

Totally going the Les Mis route here, but what if there was also some kind of future plot where the kedan themselves started to...well, not quite revolt, but verbally stand up for themselves? Like having soapbox rallys in the street or something all Les Miserables Style. I can hear it now:

"ASTI HAS SMILED UPON US THIS DAY/THE FATE OF THE TURTLE IN YOUR HAAAANDS/AND BLESSED BE THE FOREIGNERS/WHO FIGHT WITH ALL THEIR BRAVERY/WHEN ALL OF US SHOULD STAAAAAAND" medlying with a whole "BLAME MALICANT! BLAME MALICANT!"

...sorry, that was South Park, not Les Mis. But you get the idea. :P

Anyways, I would also LOVE to see more being done with the Death and Dreaming realms again, because I remember those events were huge. Especially since they were all about the individual characters themselves, and not just the World Setting. Another character-focused event might be just the thing to motivate the current playerbase, actually, because events like that are so customizable. And increasingly relevant with Malicant's influence.

(Actually, Annabeth's recent tag to Zatanna gave me an idea: what if Malicant's and/or the Dreaming/Death realms' influence were to spread to the characters themselves, even in Keelai? To the point where characters were starting to have Nightmares in their own suits, without crossing the realms? With maybe one or two dreams providing further plot clues or meta information?)

Anyways, like I said, those are just a few ideas off the top of my head.

Feel free to take or dismiss at your leisure~

I appreciate all the ideas! And viva la revolution, haha. Firstly, without saying too much, rest assured there are other Realms things in the works.

As to the ideas, my personal first step (as Kate) is to figure out the best way to go about these ideas in general - how much mods do vs how much players do, how we as mods can encourage/facilitate, etc. So with things like the Black Market and Soup Kitchen, how would you want to see them handled? Would you like the mods to run them? For an NPC affiliated with it but mainly run by players? Entirely run by players?

Yay. /insurt flaily burd here

The Soup Kitchen and Rations deliveries and minor things like that could be player run, because I think they're so "underground" that they wouldn't affect the plot directly. I actually only have a month left of work, myself, before summer vacation and would be happy to help out with things as a Player on my end, if needed/wanted.

However, something the Black Market idea DOES Have the potential to have long-term consequences over the game as a whole, and I think something like that would be better organized by one of the mods. Especially if Landfalls get involved as well.

So, basically, a mix between the two. Letting Players take charge to a certain degree, but also exerting mod presence for larger events as a continued reassurance that the people in charge are being proactive as well, y'know?

Makes sense. Certainly Costigan or an NPC (or two) could be involved with the Black Market as well.

Do you think there's a way we, as mods, can encourage players to create their own businesses/plots/events? Technically anyone can open a Soup Kitchen right now and it would be IC. Any ideas how we could make it easier, offer more support, or things like that?

Hmm.

Well, regarding the Events, perhaps something similar to how Mission Credits were rewarded as a partial count towards AC? Like, so many credits towards actually organizing the event, so many credits towards timely IC posts towards the event, etc?

Regarding the creation of businesses...maybe there could be a special page dedicated to "Advertising" each of these businesses, so that the players will feel like they have more than just an invisible presence. Something cute, that either the player or the mods could write up. (Though I'm leaning more towards having the player do it, so that it's more personalized). Like maybe a single image followed by the business name and then a small description. And this page could be advertised each month, the way the game plurk's been doing those Link Roundup posts?

I also recall something that a friend in another game used to do; her character owned a tea shop, and every month would do a Catch-All log for things going on in the tea shop, whether it be holiday celebratory events, the announcement of a new menu item, etc etc. Now, I know something like this would be more on the player than the mod, But if the suggestion were simply put out there, then people might be able to use that as an "excuse" to do more action log posts and garner more AC for themselves and their CR. Or even provide opportunites for new CR! Guaranteed monthly ideas would be a pretty big motivator for some, if you ask me. Especially those less than social characters who might be more inclined to simply bury themselves in their work and have other characters come to them.

(...like how I was able to get some post ideas in the past from Zatanna's magic shop job, for instance.)

I'm not sure exactly on the "support" end, because to me, support just means availability and answering of any questions or concerns, and so far Li has already done that beautifully (at least, from my perspective, but then we talk all the time anyway so I might be a bit biased. :P) And here you are right now, responding to each of my inputs in a timely and respectfully considerate manner, so I say you're already pretty strong in that sense.

These are all phenomenal ideas and exactly what I was looking for. Thanks a ton! Please don't hesitate to continue replying if you think of more. We'll be here using all your guys' brilliant ideas in our discussions.

And haha, thanks for the comments on support. We're definitely doing our best, but I know there's always more that can be done. c:

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unetrustworthy - 2014-05-26 21:19 (UTC) - Expand

I'm definitely agreeing with you here, and feels like a chunk of this is tied to a plurk I made a few days ago sooo

Just wanted to elaborate that Sarah's been hard for me because of the reasons above, but getting her out to do things that aren't fisticuffs and duking it out with Mali have been a little restricted as well just because of some of her CR. She's a kid, and that CR wants to keep her safe, only it's really holding me up on being able to get out and do things.

So yeah! I'm working on it, and I'm trying to find things for her that cater to all sides. This is mostly irrelevant to the main post but felt I should say something. XD

Hey Sarah Hey Sarah

Do you want to ~~build a snowman~~ get more involved, a la Baker Street Irregular-level mischief?

...honestly, that's all I've got so far, but I can't help thinking that we have a very small handful of bitties that might actually be useful if people take advantage of their bittiness.

~~Please open a detective business.~~

Quick.

Somebody Photoshop me a picture of Elle Fanning in deerstalker cap. I NEED THIS NOW

Oh hell yeah, that sounds fun. Seriously though, detective business. Count me in wherever this idea goes. C:

It's the most ridiculous idea and yet suddenly I can't get it out of my head

I'm thinking sometime next month, I'll put up an open log with her sneaking around, trying to gain some information or something. Sarah could always find her and join in? She could be Midii's spy apprentice or something.

Oh man, if we play it out right that could definitely work! :D

Then we have a plan.

I like this plan.

It's the best plan

Clearly nothing could possibly go wrong with this plan.

Yes! Definitely say something!

I completely understand what you mean and will brainstorm ways we could potentially divide CR on a temporary basis (ie a single event or mission) to help encourage her to get out more. c:

Please let me know if you think of any ways that we, as mods, can help to support or facilitate that to make it easier!

Edited 2014-05-26 21:18 (UTC)

Heya, thanks for hearing me out!

Honestly I'm still stuck for ideas myself, but if there's anything you lovely people can help with, I'll let you know. :3

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